Wow, I just got back from the Trace informational session, and I am excited!
First a photo from Todd Bates (via Vlad):
What happened was they had the following people speak for 5-10 minutes followed by a long Q&A followed by 1:1 time:
- Ted Schroth the developer
- Jim Goldberg the sales manager
- Jeff Oaklief the architect
- Robin Freeman the interior designer
- Michael Klebeck the lounge owner
And I can’t say how refreshing it was to be able to hear directly from the people involved in the project. Every project should have a round table with the team. It is one thing to get second hand impressions from the onsite agent and third hand impressions from your own agent but quite another to ask questions of the decision makers and visionaries.
Who spoke about what
Ted spoke about how he got his start with re-habing homes on Queen Anne and Capitol Hill and then acquiring this 90 year old Chicago style building which he has spent the last three years working on (he did a few other projects in between). He then talked about their desire to ‘not waste’, to have ‘retail drive the project’ and have it ‘designed around the street.’ While it was interesting to hear Ted speak what was really engaging was to talk to him one on one about the project. Turns out he is a fellow Winnipeger(!) and really believes in this project. You can tell he is pouring his heart and soul into it. As a result his enthusiasm and excitement is infectious. I hear he has a reservation down for the coolest unit, #501, the south-west penthouse, even though he wouldn’t be able to move in for another 15 years (has to wait for the kids to grow up and move out.) I was skeptical about the gym idea but I’m coming around to it after hearing him pitch it. I also get the feeling that Ted worries about every detail. Apparently he is driving RAFN crazy with design change requests and upgrades. He said him and his team spent an hour in my unit yesterday worrying about how to best route some of the duct work. (I have a hard time believing my Meritage developer ever stressed about my unit.) I also asked why they didn’t take reservations and go to purchase earlier and he said he argued with his bank about it but that he wanted people to be able to walk through their units at Trace Lofts before committing. We also discussed unit customization and upgrades and apparently RAFN refuses to do it.
Jeff spoke about the work done to the exterior to restore the brick; both the buffing and replacement of hundreds of bricks. He talked about their vision behind adding to the building with the penthouse floors and how the new integrates with the old by ‘letting the building show itself off’ and how they are incorporating new elements in Trace Lofts and recovered artifacts and materials in Trace North. He also showed us a picture of the sound lab they built in the building to test the insulation techniques. The diagrams he showed of the wall and ceiling constructions were impressive.
Jim talked about the hard hat tours beginning April 18th with purchase and sale beginning on April 21st. Sounds like reservations are also going well with 2/3rds reserved.
Robin talked about how the project was to be ‘as green as possible’ with recycled and renewed materials. The floor is recycled reclaimed solid fir flooring. No floating floors here! On the green topic, I later spoke with Ted about why they didn’t pursue LEED certification. Ted says that when he started work on the project no one was talking about LEED for residential, it was mainly a commercial initiative. Regardless it sounds like the team has gone to great lengths to be very green in their selection of materials. Ted even mentioned minimizing ordering materials which had to be delivered from the east coast. I was worried about the (recycled) vinyl flooring in the bathroom but sounds like they went this route so if people wanted they wouldn’t feel bad ripping it out later and replacing it with the tile they wanted. Robin will also be purchasing a unit at the building.
Michael talked about the lounge; the vault door, the speak easy entrance, the vintage roulette table. I didn’t realize just how many projects he’s done around Seattle. Sounds like the Gunclub is going to be quite the cool place (apparently his mother does not like the name). Michael also sounds a little eccentric :).
Here are some random facts:
- HOA’s for Trace Lofts are a flat $298. Innovative idea.
- Heat is electric forced air
- Water heaters in every unit
- Trace Lofts and Trace North will have separate HOAs and won’t share common amenities like roof top decks
- Madrona Real Estate Services is the property management company
- One of the RAFN construction folks bought a unit
- Parking: 189 stalls. 99 for Trace North, 47 for Trace Lofts, rest for retail plus one motorcycle spot. No guest parking.
- Trace Lofts will come late summer. Sounds like September.
- Trace North will come Spring 2008
- Pets do not have a weight limit.
Having just signed a reservation commitment for Rollin Street in the morning it is clear I’m on the fence but spending time talking to Ted I am very excited about Trace. This guy is dedicated to his project (he is in apparently no rush to move on to the next project like so many developers are) and sounds like he may even surprise us on price (he did on HOA’s!).
I’m sure I left out a lot of details so if you attended I’d love to hear what information you gathered as well as your impressions.
Popularity: 9% [?]
41 responses so far ↓
1 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 8:54 am
Sounds fantastic! Read: Trace sounds much better than Rollins!
2 Rachel // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:04 am
I was happy with the session last evening as well. I agree that everyone seemed pretty energized about the project. I love the philosophy of saving the building and being selective about the retail tenants. They had everyone fill in comment cards about the kinds of retail we want to see.
A few other tidbits:
*Final prices and purchase and sale docs will be set/sent out the week of April 8th.
*Pets have no weight limit, but only 2 are allowed per unit.
*There are 42 Trace Lofts units, and 47 parking spots. They haven’t decided what will happen with those extra 5 (i.e. if they will be for sale).
*The parking garage entrance is in the Trace North Building off of 12th. It is 99% that we will be able to use it even before North is finished.
*Window coverings are NOT included. They are going to put together 3rd party options. Outside facing sides of window coverings must be black.
*The kitchen countertops are not slab, but 18″ tiles. The grout will be color matched.
*Some units have big, quilted slider doors that were original to the building. Jim has a list of what units have them. They had to but put in the units before the doors were framed because they are so big.
My one concern is that Jeff said that some brick had to be covered with drywall/wainscoting for insulation purposes. Hopefully not too much…
3 Justin // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:21 am
More random facts:
- The low econ flooring in the bathroom isn’t as ugly in person as on the website.
- They are working on a deal to allow home owners to trade-up appliances (you have to go through thier vendor).
- They will have W/D packages.
- Blinds have to be black on the outside (I thought that was cool).
- They are thinking about providing the option of discounted interior designer consultation to homeowners.
They designed thier own sound isulation (they had an on-site test lab).
- All stove hoods are externally vented. But on floors 2 and 3 it’s a microwave vent, so if you want a commercial grade stove you’ll have to rip out the microwave and put in a new hood (doubt anyone cares about that but me).
- Water, sewer, and garbage (i think) is not included in HOA dues.
4 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:25 am
Justin, I hate you.
5 Matt // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:31 am
Foster, you don’t even want to live at Trace!
6 Justin // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:31 am
Foster, ilu.
7 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:40 am
I didn’t at the time that you guys were buying, but now hearing you all talk about how fabulous it is going to be… and how the beautiful people will all be there having 24/7 sexy naked parties…
I want in!
8 Justin // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:41 am
Just got a picture of the quilted door that will be the door to the bedroom in most (or some) of the Trace Loft units.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7542733@N05/438846841/
9 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:44 am
Seeing that quilted door reminds me of the gorgeous loft of Brian Kinney on QAF. It only makes me want Trace more than ever. You guys are lame, I shoulda bought a unit at Trace and at Mosler. =P
10 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:52 am
Foster, yes, Brian had a gorgeous loft.
And hey nearly everyone at the event last night was wearing Diesel jeans or their equivalent. The place is going to be full of hip and fabulous people which can’t be said for all the towers going up in the downtown area.
11 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:55 am
Whatever. You’re all going to be so depressed when Eastlake turns out to be the new sexy hotspot. Yes… you will…
12 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:11 am
Ugh, Eastlake as the new sexy hot spot? Check out the restaurants around there: Hooters, Stix, Bluwater, Joey’s. You couldn’t pick a straighter place to live :P. But hey, you are a force to be reckoned with, I’m sure you can single handedly turn it around!
13 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:13 am
What do I care if they are straight when I find them?
14 vc // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:16 am
What’s the rationale behind the flat HOA? That doesn’t make any sense to me. Larger units tend to have more people in them. Each person in a unit consumes resources that the HOA covers: gas, hallway carpeting, elevator use, common area wear and tear, etc. Flat HOAs benefit the large units at the expense of the small units.
I’d be happy about the flat HOAs if I were in one of the large units, but unhappy if I were in a lower-end unit.
Dues should be tied to square footage (and things like terraces, parking spots, and so on) to be fair.
15 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:30 am
VC, the logic was that all the utilities are individually metered (I believe he even mentioned that they did some funky metering for the sprinklers for the 12 units that have plants on their terraces so that people who don’t have terraces aren’t paying the water bills of those who do) so the HOA fee really is only about the common resources. Since the majority of the units are one bedroom and clustered around the same square footage every unit is using those resources equally.
Plus, it wouldn’t be fair if I was a single guy in the penthouse and there were two people living in the smallest unit. Arguably they’re putting more wear and tear on the common elements then I am. Perhaps HOA should be charged per person and not by per unit or square foot but that would get too convoluted.
16 vc // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:40 am
Yeah, I agree that you can’t charge per person (because that would involve monitoring births, marriages, divorces, visitors, and so on).
But a flat HOA structure (like a flat tax structure) benefits the people at the top of the wealth pyramid.
There are sprinklers on the terraces? Oh boy. Those things will cause unsightly drips / leaks. Terraced apartments should be paying higher dues.
Well, TANSTAAFL. If the dues aren’t sufficient to cover maintenance, they will be raised. It’ll be interesting to see whether the building’s residents will vote to keep the flat structure when residents do the math and discover that lesser-endowed units are in fact subsidizing better-endowed units.
17 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:48 am
I’m skeptical too and would love for the developer to comment here directly on what he’s thinking since he can explain it better than I can as it was clear he certainly has put a lot of thought into the idea.
I think it’s an interesting experiment so I’m supportive from that angle. Plus I’m in a unit that would likely pencil out at $300/sq ft even if it was per square foot.
18 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:54 am
Matt, how many bedrooms does your trace unit have? How many sq ft?
19 Rachel // Mar 29, 2007 at 10:56 am
They stressed how much attention they paid to waterproofing. The units with the irrigation will be paying for the water for the plants.
They convinced me that they had done the due diligence to be sure that the dues were sufficient, and they are immediately putting some in reserves. Most units are around 650-850 square feet, with a few outliers on both ends. There are only four 2-bed units (out of 42). I am happy with the plan for dues.
20 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 11:06 am
Foster, 1 bedroom, 769sf + 121sf terrace.
21 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 11:38 am
Matt, I knew that info was online but I didn’t want to go looking for it. I am reading through the SM article right now, will keep you posted if I find a MG quote.
22 jo // Mar 29, 2007 at 12:20 pm
Funny comment about the type of people at the event last night. I went to one for Olive8 last night and…well, it was a different crowd.
23 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 12:29 pm
I popped into the Olive8 sales center for the first time on Tuesday. When I walked in, there wasn’t a soul to be found at the front desk or anywhere in the sales center. After about 7 minutes of waiting, I started walking out and a lady approached me and said, “You can’t be in here without signing a guest card.”
I replied, “Thats alright, I was just leaving.”
24 kh // Mar 29, 2007 at 1:39 pm
that’s right matt was staring at everyone’s jeans last night :)
i thought the presentations and conversations afterward were great! i was a little skeptical going in, but hearing Ted’s enthusiasm and talking to Robin about her reasoning behind a few of the material choices, i left with a smile.
but for the record, vinyl flooring is BAD for the environment. no matter if it’s recycled or not. just check out the film blue vinyl. http://www.bluevinyl.org/
25 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 1:51 pm
Some homebuilders are now using Marmoleum. Google it, very interesting stuff..
26 Matt // Mar 29, 2007 at 1:53 pm
I have Marmoleum in my Meritage bathroom. The developer likes it because it’s cheaper than tile and green. I don’t like it because it’s not tile and looks like vinyl flooring.
27 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 2:11 pm
Matt doesn’t like it because its not high-falootin, nor is it considered “fancypants”.
28 jo // Mar 29, 2007 at 2:19 pm
Our Meritage bathroom floors blow. I can’t wait to rip mine up.
29 EconE // Mar 29, 2007 at 2:21 pm
I’ve laughed at the $300 jeans phenomenon for some time now.
Denim Bubble?
30 Foster // Mar 29, 2007 at 2:50 pm
jo, what about the floors bothers you? Are they low quality? Do they not hold up well? Or is it just that you want tile?
31 kh // Mar 29, 2007 at 3:32 pm
marmoleum still looks like sheet vinyl… even if it is a little better for the environmnent.
http://www.themarmoleumstore.com
32 Matt // Mar 29, 2007 at 5:03 pm
Sadly, my reserved unit, #408, will not be getting a quilted elevator door. Since the bedroom doesn’t have doors on it I would love to find something similar to act as door/divider. Any suggestions?
Jim did say that 406, 506, 212 and 312 will be getting doors.
33 EconE // Mar 29, 2007 at 5:49 pm
Here’s a door company that might interest you.
http://www.neoporte.com/
34 Jared // Mar 29, 2007 at 8:55 pm
The Q&A completely got me psyched too! I think the building is going to be great, and I drove by the outside today the care and restoration put into it really shows. I’m still a juat a wee bit skeptical about how cool the bathrooms/kitchens will be (that basin sink is the standard-issue sink in every Vancouver highrise built in 2005/06 it seems) but when it comes down to it most of that can be tweaked with later anyway. I’m officially excited.
35 Matt Goyer // Mar 29, 2007 at 9:55 pm
Jared, I agree about the kitchen and bathrooms. Seems like they are putting a lot of effort everywhere else though. I’m sure once I’ve lived there a bit I’ll renovate those two areas.
BTW, which unit did you reserve?
36 Kristina // Mar 30, 2007 at 10:04 am
I love the marketing! I am curious about the following:
Why would they not aim to obtain LEED Certified? It’s not just a commercial initiative, it’s a national initiative that we should strive to live in better environments. They could still try to obtain the LEED certification and you can find more about this at http://www.usgbc.org/LEED
In the end, this is a WOOD FRAMED BUILDING. No matter what they do for sound insulation between floors and units, the fact remains that wood framed buildings don’t hold up over time. They warp, they change shape and they transmit noise. Want an example or two: How about Belltown Court? I lived there fora couple years and it was the worst experience in my life. Not great buildings 10 years later.
I would be curious about the non-floating floors. Reclaimed Fir wood is beautiful, but it doesn’t stand the test of time. How many times can you refinish it? Fir is a soft wood, so it will scuff up much quicker. Further, I can’t wear my heels or have people come over in their heels… unless you want to have the Swiss cheese look.
Why rip out vinyl and replace it with tile? That doesn’t sound very Green to me. It sounds like they are doing the best job they can of selling an inferior product.
I love the $298 dollars no matter what unit you are in. That means you can purchase the most expensive unit (read: Developer buying penthouse) in the building and have the least expensive unit pay more of my costs. Great, innovative, steal from the poor and pay the rich idea. This will really come in handy when a special assessment is assessed on every unit because the largest unit in the building has water intrusion problems. Do you realize that most of your homeowner fees are associated with the insurance on the building? Does it even have earthquake insurance?
Electric Forced Air? I understand not wanting to sell the washer/dryer in the unit (added costs that aren’t mitigated, and thus becoming a profit center when you upgrade to them) but electric forced air? Why not just put Cadet heaters in every room with one thermostat.
Water Heaters in every unit: Great! No gas, no problem. The most expensive cost in your electricity bill is heating the hot water. Enjoy the bills!
Ducts in your unit? Where are those ducts going? What are they venting?
Why wait until you can show off part of the building? Some ideas:
a. It costs money to build a nice presentation center
b. Bank on the appreciation of the neighborhood to help garner more $$ in the selling of the units
c. Set the prices more based on interest than actual costs.
10. How respected is the property management company? I haven’t ever heard of them and they are the ones running the books on the association? Anyone hear of them or see what they have done in action? Do they have any other properties of this proportion?
37 Matt // Apr 1, 2007 at 10:23 am
These erosion sinks would look nice at Trace: http://goredesignco.com/
38 EconE // Apr 1, 2007 at 12:32 pm
Thanks for the link Matt…that sink is “bad ass”! I also like the clean lines of the Laguna Ramp sink.
39 Aly // Apr 3, 2007 at 6:25 pm
“On the green topic, I later spoke with Ted about why they didn’t pursue LEED certification. Ted says that when he started work on the project no one was talking about LEED for residential, it was mainly a commercial initiative”
I’m a leed certified architect. It is true that leed is not geared so much for ’single family’ residential. but Trace is a mixed use multifamily building. And we have examples of leed certified multifamily projects in seattle that were done quite some time ago. it’s sad that developers will smile at you while they’re lying. I just feel like they’ll do anything just to sell their projects. Some developers put some green make-up to market their properties. if you’re really serious about green, prove it to me by getting at least a leed certification. It’s great you have this blog. this way we can all join forces and try to make sense of this extremely aggressive market…
40 Aly // Apr 3, 2007 at 6:36 pm
sorry, i think all my comments on your blogs so far have been pesimistic… What the hell! I should relax I little :) I think I’m just bitter that I don’t have money to develop a project myself :) But.. maybe some day..
41 Matt // Apr 3, 2007 at 6:54 pm
Hi Aly, thanks for the comments. I’m bitter too that I can’t do my own projects. We should team up some day. Maybe we could find buyers before we start, raise money from them and build the project we all want.
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