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	<title>Comments on: Wedgwood: the city&#8217;s poor land use planning results in a proposed property that aims to take all it can get</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/</link>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13466</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 22:34:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13466</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t buy that argument MW, given the very small percentage of  the city zoned for commercial uses (especially in the neighborhoods) you had to anticipate that in the intervening ten years there would be some potential for redevelopment. What year was it ten years ago? 1997. Nope, no big time growth going on then that could foretold what might occur later. You made a bet, in essense, that you were willing to live with the risk of redevelopment next door given all sorts of positive aspects of the house that would be available immediately. If the risk of redevelopment had been appropriately discounted, there would be some hit to the price that you probably also benefited from, if indeed you were aware of the potential of development

The jail and the sex offender thing are poor analogies - the odds of them occuring are infitesmally small relative to a development being built in a zone where it is currently allowed as of right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t buy that argument MW, given the very small percentage of  the city zoned for commercial uses (especially in the neighborhoods) you had to anticipate that in the intervening ten years there would be some potential for redevelopment. What year was it ten years ago? 1997. Nope, no big time growth going on then that could foretold what might occur later. You made a bet, in essense, that you were willing to live with the risk of redevelopment next door given all sorts of positive aspects of the house that would be available immediately. If the risk of redevelopment had been appropriately discounted, there would be some hit to the price that you probably also benefited from, if indeed you were aware of the potential of development</p>
<p>The jail and the sex offender thing are poor analogies &#8211; the odds of them occuring are infitesmally small relative to a development being built in a zone where it is currently allowed as of right.</p>
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		<title>By: MW</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13446</link>
		<dc:creator>MW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 19:19:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13446</guid>
		<description>kimzilla,
Ha, ha!  I would become a nudist myself if I thought it would help (although with this weather, I may not be outside much)!  

I don&#039;t see myself renting or moving anytime soon, and I just hope the owners of the property behind me don&#039;t get greedy and think they can maximize profit by selling to a developer with no scruples about the impact of the eight houses behind this property.  

Wedgwood is predominantly a single-family residential community and lacks a large commercial district where there would be a good transition area between 4 story mixed use buildings and single family homes.  I think any new development needs to also consider the traffic congestion that already exists along 35th... the street just happens to be an arterial; that doesn&#039;t mean it&#039;s an appropriate place to have this 40&#039; commercial zoning.  

In response to the person who thought I should have considered zoning laws when I bought my house... I was concerned with the normal things people consider when purchasing their first home: safety, schools, location of amenities, neighborhood &quot;feel,&quot; etc.  I was concerned that the restaurant behind us wouldn&#039;t leave their dumpster open us to smell.  I never imagined that 10 years down the road there would be a development boom with condos popping up all over.  No one could have anticipated that.  Be reasonable and consider what you thought of when you bought a home (assuming you have).  I suspect that if you bought a home and you later found out that the city was going to put in a dump next door, or a low-security jail, or a home for convicted sex offenders, you might be concerned about how it impacted you!  If your neighbor said they were going to tear down their house and build a mc mansion that blocked your prime view of the Olympics, but it was in their zoning rights to do it, you would call them bad neighbors.  Am I wrong?  All I am saying is that you can&#039;t blame someone for not anticipating everything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>kimzilla,<br />
Ha, ha!  I would become a nudist myself if I thought it would help (although with this weather, I may not be outside much)!  </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t see myself renting or moving anytime soon, and I just hope the owners of the property behind me don&#8217;t get greedy and think they can maximize profit by selling to a developer with no scruples about the impact of the eight houses behind this property.  </p>
<p>Wedgwood is predominantly a single-family residential community and lacks a large commercial district where there would be a good transition area between 4 story mixed use buildings and single family homes.  I think any new development needs to also consider the traffic congestion that already exists along 35th&#8230; the street just happens to be an arterial; that doesn&#8217;t mean it&#8217;s an appropriate place to have this 40&#8242; commercial zoning.  </p>
<p>In response to the person who thought I should have considered zoning laws when I bought my house&#8230; I was concerned with the normal things people consider when purchasing their first home: safety, schools, location of amenities, neighborhood &#8220;feel,&#8221; etc.  I was concerned that the restaurant behind us wouldn&#8217;t leave their dumpster open us to smell.  I never imagined that 10 years down the road there would be a development boom with condos popping up all over.  No one could have anticipated that.  Be reasonable and consider what you thought of when you bought a home (assuming you have).  I suspect that if you bought a home and you later found out that the city was going to put in a dump next door, or a low-security jail, or a home for convicted sex offenders, you might be concerned about how it impacted you!  If your neighbor said they were going to tear down their house and build a mc mansion that blocked your prime view of the Olympics, but it was in their zoning rights to do it, you would call them bad neighbors.  Am I wrong?  All I am saying is that you can&#8217;t blame someone for not anticipating everything.</p>
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		<title>By: kimzilla</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13311</link>
		<dc:creator>kimzilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Aug 2007 02:23:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13311</guid>
		<description>MW, have you considered moving and renting your house to a bunch of sun-loving nudists;-);-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MW, have you considered moving and renting your house to a bunch of sun-loving nudists;-);-)</p>
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		<title>By: d</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13265</link>
		<dc:creator>d</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 18:06:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13265</guid>
		<description>I am suggesting that cities contain four story buildings on commercial strips. Suburbs and rural areas contain single story supermarkets with huge parking lots. I think the idea of establishing a buffer zone--i.e. increasing height limits in the block or two immediately west and east of 35th--is a good one, and I said that. I like that idea. But that&#039;s not gonna do much for the people who currently live in the small, single-family home. 

The calculus I see is that the city needs to start maximizing residency and services on its main streets more than the owner of a small, single family home needs not to live next to a taller building. That&#039;s the essence of NIMBYism--a tragedy of the commons.

As for the question of disproportionate scale--there is always goign to be some disproportionate scale, and there particularly always will be in times of heavy growth. It won&#039;t be disproportionate for long if the neighborhood and city get their shit together and allow 4 story buildings on 35th, 2-3 story apartment complexes in the block or two to either side, and townhouses in the actual neighborhoods.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am suggesting that cities contain four story buildings on commercial strips. Suburbs and rural areas contain single story supermarkets with huge parking lots. I think the idea of establishing a buffer zone&#8211;i.e. increasing height limits in the block or two immediately west and east of 35th&#8211;is a good one, and I said that. I like that idea. But that&#8217;s not gonna do much for the people who currently live in the small, single-family home. </p>
<p>The calculus I see is that the city needs to start maximizing residency and services on its main streets more than the owner of a small, single family home needs not to live next to a taller building. That&#8217;s the essence of NIMBYism&#8211;a tragedy of the commons.</p>
<p>As for the question of disproportionate scale&#8211;there is always goign to be some disproportionate scale, and there particularly always will be in times of heavy growth. It won&#8217;t be disproportionate for long if the neighborhood and city get their shit together and allow 4 story buildings on 35th, 2-3 story apartment complexes in the block or two to either side, and townhouses in the actual neighborhoods.</p>
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		<title>By: BKG</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13259</link>
		<dc:creator>BKG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 15:11:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13259</guid>
		<description></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Dear God, no!!! 4 story buildings on the main commercial strip?!!! Within the city limits of a large, growing city!!! Say it ain’t so!!!&#8221;</p>
<p>The problem, again, is the incompatible zoning, not four story building. The houses directly behind all areas zoned NC2-40, which again are small (less than 1000 sq ft, single story homes) would be directly abutting massive, disproportionately scaled buildings, as we are seeing per this current project.</p>
<p>Are you suggesting that this is reasonable urban planning, and this is what we should expect if we live in the city? I would disagree.</p>
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		<title>By: jo</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13223</link>
		<dc:creator>jo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 06:16:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13223</guid>
		<description>Yea, that stinks. However, when you bought the house you should have looked into zoning laws. If you were not comfortable with this type of development possibly happening some day, you should have never bought the house and bought in an area which you were comfortable with the zoning laws.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yea, that stinks. However, when you bought the house you should have looked into zoning laws. If you were not comfortable with this type of development possibly happening some day, you should have never bought the house and bought in an area which you were comfortable with the zoning laws.</p>
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		<title>By: MW</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13206</link>
		<dc:creator>MW</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Aug 2007 23:38:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13206</guid>
		<description>I am just now joining this conversation, and it seems that we all know that Wedgwood is a neighborhood that was developed in the 40&#039;s and 50&#039;s, and that it has some zoning that worries residents.  When we talk about NIMBYs, we assume that these are intolerant, old-fashioned, and inflexible people.  I wouldn&#039;t want to consider myself a NIMBY, but I happen to own a house that directly backs up to this commercial district, so my back yard is directly involved in this issue!  I believe that the way this commercial peoperty is currently zoned, it would significantly devalue my home, and violate the design guidelines (minimizing disruption of privacy, etc.) if a 4 story mixed use building went up behind my home.  I would think that any reasonable person who had a significant amount of equity and love of their neighborhood would worry about such loss of value and privacy.  I would be more inclined to support building projects that were limited to two stories; then I wouldn&#039;t feel like my life was on display for anyone who lived on the back side of the building.  Calling attention to the potential problems with this current project will hopefully address future development issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am just now joining this conversation, and it seems that we all know that Wedgwood is a neighborhood that was developed in the 40&#8217;s and 50&#8217;s, and that it has some zoning that worries residents.  When we talk about NIMBYs, we assume that these are intolerant, old-fashioned, and inflexible people.  I wouldn&#8217;t want to consider myself a NIMBY, but I happen to own a house that directly backs up to this commercial district, so my back yard is directly involved in this issue!  I believe that the way this commercial peoperty is currently zoned, it would significantly devalue my home, and violate the design guidelines (minimizing disruption of privacy, etc.) if a 4 story mixed use building went up behind my home.  I would think that any reasonable person who had a significant amount of equity and love of their neighborhood would worry about such loss of value and privacy.  I would be more inclined to support building projects that were limited to two stories; then I wouldn&#8217;t feel like my life was on display for anyone who lived on the back side of the building.  Calling attention to the potential problems with this current project will hopefully address future development issues.</p>
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		<title>By: d</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13204</link>
		<dc:creator>d</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Aug 2007 22:52:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13204</guid>
		<description>One clarification--my Ozzie and Harriet comment was a reference to the single family homes with yards, not to family structures--I didn&#039;t mean to imply social intolerance or bigotry on the part of Wedgwood residents. Also, I think it&#039;s admirable that the group proposes as an alternative a buffer zone from the main strip.

However, I think there remains a strong strain of NIMBYism in the group&#039;s aims and writings. Look at the Wedgwood group&#039;s website, from July 27th:

&quot;If this project goes through it sets a precendent for other properties. Imagine knocking down the Rite Aid, All that Dance, the Windermere Building, the QFC, Wedgwood Broiler, etc.. and replacing their entire footprints with 4 story multi-use properties. No offense, but this would look a lot more like Lake City Way than Wedgwood.&quot;

Dear God, no!!! 4 story buildings on the main commercial strip?!!! Within the city limits of a large, growing city!!! Say it ain&#039;t so!!!

This is what cities have--multi-story buildings on commercial streets. Is a one-story Rite Aid or QFC (with its wasted open space on parking (minimizing density and causing run-off issues) really better than a four-story building that allows more people to live near goods and services? If you want increased transit, you need the density to sustain it. Such developments would help your cause.

I don&#039;t begrudge any neighborhood trying to get something out of its developers, but I find a lot of the pro-density rhetoric from groups like Wedgwood action disngenuous when they consider multistory development on main streets to be some sort of apocalyptic vision.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One clarification&#8211;my Ozzie and Harriet comment was a reference to the single family homes with yards, not to family structures&#8211;I didn&#8217;t mean to imply social intolerance or bigotry on the part of Wedgwood residents. Also, I think it&#8217;s admirable that the group proposes as an alternative a buffer zone from the main strip.</p>
<p>However, I think there remains a strong strain of NIMBYism in the group&#8217;s aims and writings. Look at the Wedgwood group&#8217;s website, from July 27th:</p>
<p>&#8220;If this project goes through it sets a precendent for other properties. Imagine knocking down the Rite Aid, All that Dance, the Windermere Building, the QFC, Wedgwood Broiler, etc.. and replacing their entire footprints with 4 story multi-use properties. No offense, but this would look a lot more like Lake City Way than Wedgwood.&#8221;</p>
<p>Dear God, no!!! 4 story buildings on the main commercial strip?!!! Within the city limits of a large, growing city!!! Say it ain&#8217;t so!!!</p>
<p>This is what cities have&#8211;multi-story buildings on commercial streets. Is a one-story Rite Aid or QFC (with its wasted open space on parking (minimizing density and causing run-off issues) really better than a four-story building that allows more people to live near goods and services? If you want increased transit, you need the density to sustain it. Such developments would help your cause.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t begrudge any neighborhood trying to get something out of its developers, but I find a lot of the pro-density rhetoric from groups like Wedgwood action disngenuous when they consider multistory development on main streets to be some sort of apocalyptic vision.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13200</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:42:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13200</guid>
		<description>Any good developer knows $, land, influence and political capital are fungible. You build over neighborhood objection at your own risk. Legally able and politcally able with no later financial ramifications are two different things</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any good developer knows $, land, influence and political capital are fungible. You build over neighborhood objection at your own risk. Legally able and politcally able with no later financial ramifications are two different things</p>
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		<title>By: jo</title>
		<link>http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/comment-page-1/#comment-13194</link>
		<dc:creator>jo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Aug 2007 18:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbnlivn.com/2007/08/01/wedgwood-the-citys-poor-land-use-planning-results-in-a-proposed-property-that-aims-to-take-all-it-can-get/#comment-13194</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand this.

The developer owns the land and as long as he is within his legal rights, what business is it of you guys to have a say in what goes there?

If you want to dictate what gets developed there, you should have bought it yourself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand this.</p>
<p>The developer owns the land and as long as he is within his legal rights, what business is it of you guys to have a say in what goes there?</p>
<p>If you want to dictate what gets developed there, you should have bought it yourself.</p>
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