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Trace North now three months delayed

By Matt Goyer January 11, 2008

When folks signed purchase and sale for Trace North their closing was January 15th and as late as early November this was still believed to be the anticipated close date but throughout the holidays that date has moved all the way back to April 18th. HOA dues have also increased to $234.63/month.

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40 responses to “Trace North now three months delayed”

dunno says:

January 12, 2008 at 12:10 am

3 month delay seems to be the norm unfortunately. I hope it’s not delayed even further for those who bought.
dunno says:

January 11, 2008 at 4:10 pm

3 month delay seems to be the norm unfortunately. I hope it’s not delayed even further for those who bought.
Dan C. says:

January 12, 2008 at 12:16 am

A little off topic…but don’t know where to put this.

What is up with the 5th and Madison Condo Tower? I think I read on this blog that it was 100% pre-sold…but I can see into every unit from my office, and I only count 10 units with furniture. Every other unit is totally empty.

Smells to me like another Cosmo-esque resale nightmare.
Dan C. says:

January 11, 2008 at 4:16 pm

A little off topic…but don’t know where to put this.

What is up with the 5th and Madison Condo Tower? I think I read on this blog that it was 100% pre-sold…but I can see into every unit from my office, and I only count 10 units with furniture. Every other unit is totally empty.

Smells to me like another Cosmo-esque resale nightmare.
mattgoyer says:

January 12, 2008 at 12:59 am

Re: 5th and Madison

Last I checked there were 32 of 126 units unsold.
Matt says:

January 11, 2008 at 4:59 pm

Re: 5th and Madison

Last I checked there were 32 of 126 units unsold.
Peckham says:

January 12, 2008 at 4:32 am

“HOA dues have also increased to $234.63/month.

They only go one direction, and that is up.
Peckham says:

January 11, 2008 at 8:32 pm

“HOA dues have also increased to $234.63/month.

They only go one direction, and that is up.
dunno says:

January 12, 2008 at 5:59 pm

There also was no investor cap at 5th and Madison if I remember correctly. This was likely due to the slow sales but may end up seriously hurting anyone who bought there.
dunno says:

January 12, 2008 at 9:59 am

There also was no investor cap at 5th and Madison if I remember correctly. This was likely due to the slow sales but may end up seriously hurting anyone who bought there.
Steve says:

January 13, 2008 at 10:04 pm

I believe some transparency would be beneficial on understanding 5th and Madison. Of the 126 homes here, 89 have closed with 6 more to close in the next 30 or so days. A total of 11 homes are investment status or less than 9% of the project. (6 homes are now rented, with four resales on the MLS)

With almost all homes having closed by mid-December, it is very unlikely the above numbers will change by much. The remaining inventory will most likely be owner occupants as once again it is time for buyers to find a home.

5th and Madison is a new building that will be over 90% owner occupied from inception.

Steve Paoli
Community sales manager
5th and Madison
Steve says:

January 13, 2008 at 2:04 pm

I believe some transparency would be beneficial on understanding 5th and Madison. Of the 126 homes here, 89 have closed with 6 more to close in the next 30 or so days. A total of 11 homes are investment status or less than 9% of the project. (6 homes are now rented, with four resales on the MLS)

With almost all homes having closed by mid-December, it is very unlikely the above numbers will change by much. The remaining inventory will most likely be owner occupants as once again it is time for buyers to find a home.

5th and Madison is a new building that will be over 90% owner occupied from inception.

Steve Paoli
Community sales manager
5th and Madison
dunno says:

January 14, 2008 at 4:26 am

I have no reason to doubt the numbers you give, Steve, but how do you really know what unit was bought as an investment and what was not? I think the only way you could know is by the mortage application, if there was one, or by what the buyer told you. It is easy, as far as I know, to change your primary residence and there are incentives to declaring the home you are purchasing as your primary residence to get better rates. You work in the industry where as I do not so let me know if I am wrong. In any case I hope you are right becasue I hate flippers.
dunno says:

January 13, 2008 at 8:26 pm

I have no reason to doubt the numbers you give, Steve, but how do you really know what unit was bought as an investment and what was not? I think the only way you could know is by the mortage application, if there was one, or by what the buyer told you. It is easy, as far as I know, to change your primary residence and there are incentives to declaring the home you are purchasing as your primary residence to get better rates. You work in the industry where as I do not so let me know if I am wrong. In any case I hope you are right becasue I hate flippers.
steve says:

January 14, 2008 at 8:16 am

I have been in site sales for 10 years, and look forward to meeting you, Dunno, one day.

My mantra in sales is provide facts and let the buyer decide. I live in one of my previous projects, enjoy the lifestyle, have made equity and am pleased with the experience.
With the 5th and Madison project…understand after a month plus after closing a home (most closed in Nov.)….One declares themselves as an owner or “flipper” How do I now the intentions of owners? Immediately at Cosmopolition Condos…70+ homes entered the market because the mortgage clock started ticking. This is not the case at this property. 5 homes are on the MLS, and another 6 rented. This is an owner occupant building.

Steve
steve says:

January 14, 2008 at 12:16 am

I have been in site sales for 10 years, and look forward to meeting you, Dunno, one day.

My mantra in sales is provide facts and let the buyer decide. I live in one of my previous projects, enjoy the lifestyle, have made equity and am pleased with the experience.
With the 5th and Madison project…understand after a month plus after closing a home (most closed in Nov.)….One declares themselves as an owner or “flipper” How do I now the intentions of owners? Immediately at Cosmopolition Condos…70+ homes entered the market because the mortgage clock started ticking. This is not the case at this property. 5 homes are on the MLS, and another 6 rented. This is an owner occupant building.

Steve
dunno says:

January 14, 2008 at 10:07 am

We have met. I would recognize your style anywhere. Thanks for the information. Sounds like you have a good group of owners and I wish you the best.
dunno says:

January 14, 2008 at 2:07 am

We have met. I would recognize your style anywhere. Thanks for the information. Sounds like you have a good group of owners and I wish you the best.
Dan C. says:

January 14, 2008 at 10:37 pm

Back to my original comment, there sure are a ton of empty units (appears to be 90%+)…doesn’t seem like a lot of “owners” are occupying.
Dan C. says:

January 14, 2008 at 2:37 pm

Back to my original comment, there sure are a ton of empty units (appears to be 90%+)…doesn’t seem like a lot of “owners” are occupying.
dunno says:

January 15, 2008 at 4:36 am

Hey Matt, you would not believe what happened. As you know I have been arguing back and forth with Steve, the salesman at 5th and Madison, on your site. The next thing I know someone else uses my alias (dunno) at Wendy’s condo site (http://www.seattlecondoreview.com/) numerous times saying that the water pipe problems at 5th and Madison are no big deal (article under “Leaky condos…nope not fake stucco” 1/11/08). Basically he is pretending to be me. Now, it is not my site so I have no way to know who it really was. But who could it be but Steve? I thought it was amazing when condo sales people would send offensive materials to you. Having gone through the same thing I find it mildly amusing. Do they completely want to alienate their customers? They are just brainless. Please be on the look out, Matt, although I don’t think he will try it here considering you have to give your e-mail address. Unbelievable!
dunno says:

January 14, 2008 at 8:36 pm

Hey Matt, you would not believe what happened. As you know I have been arguing back and forth with Steve, the salesman at 5th and Madison, on your site. The next thing I know someone else uses my alias (dunno) at Wendy’s condo site (http://www.seattlecondoreview.com/) numerous times saying that the water pipe problems at 5th and Madison are no big deal (article under “Leaky condos…nope not fake stucco” 1/11/08). Basically he is pretending to be me. Now, it is not my site so I have no way to know who it really was. But who could it be but Steve? I thought it was amazing when condo sales people would send offensive materials to you. Having gone through the same thing I find it mildly amusing. Do they completely want to alienate their customers? They are just brainless. Please be on the look out, Matt, although I don’t think he will try it here considering you have to give your e-mail address. Unbelievable!
mattgoyer says:

January 15, 2008 at 5:25 am

Dunno, well you never know who it could be, there a few condo haters and supporters here who might masquerade as someone; I wouldn’t jump to conclusions yet. However, it definitely sucks that someone is pretending to be you!
Matt says:

January 14, 2008 at 9:25 pm

Dunno, well you never know who it could be, there a few condo haters and supporters here who might masquerade as someone; I wouldn’t jump to conclusions yet. However, it definitely sucks that someone is pretending to be you!
Steve says:

January 16, 2008 at 2:09 am

Thanks Matt for putting some sense into Dunno’s accusation that I had anything to do with using another’s name on a site. As a real estate professional, I join these discussions (read my transparency comment above)to provide balanced opinion.

Dunno, do you really want to print an accusation like what you just did. I dunno…it is reckless to have a hunch and go to press without any substantiation. The whole thread above started with a comment on a new condo being dark, so the writer could “smell” an investor building. I joined the discussion with the fact that a half dozen homes are on the MLS, with as many being rented. I am all about being informative not tricky. I am personally insulted with Dunno. Anyone who reads his comments in any blog should question his objectivity.

Steve Paoli
Steve says:

January 15, 2008 at 6:09 pm

Thanks Matt for putting some sense into Dunno’s accusation that I had anything to do with using another’s name on a site. As a real estate professional, I join these discussions (read my transparency comment above)to provide balanced opinion.

Dunno, do you really want to print an accusation like what you just did. I dunno…it is reckless to have a hunch and go to press without any substantiation. The whole thread above started with a comment on a new condo being dark, so the writer could “smell” an investor building. I joined the discussion with the fact that a half dozen homes are on the MLS, with as many being rented. I am all about being informative not tricky. I am personally insulted with Dunno. Anyone who reads his comments in any blog should question his objectivity.

Steve Paoli
dunno says:

January 16, 2008 at 2:57 am

It is funny to hear the word “objectivity” coming from a condo salesman. To reply, I make no claim to be objective and never have. Everything I write is a complete testament to my biases and beliefs.

As I mentioned before, I have no proof it WAS you. However, I absolutely believe it was and I’ll post that every day of the week. As for being insulted, my intelligence was frequently insulted by the drivel given out by many in your profession. Why do you think so many people, including myself, start blogs and come to sites like this?
dunno says:

January 15, 2008 at 6:57 pm

It is funny to hear the word “objectivity” coming from a condo salesman. To reply, I make no claim to be objective and never have. Everything I write is a complete testament to my biases and beliefs.

As I mentioned before, I have no proof it WAS you. However, I absolutely believe it was and I’ll post that every day of the week. As for being insulted, my intelligence was frequently insulted by the drivel given out by many in your profession. Why do you think so many people, including myself, start blogs and come to sites like this?
Bob says:

January 16, 2008 at 7:45 am

dunno, anyone can use your name just like anyone can use mine. Unless you can compare ip addresses, it doesn’t make sense to be so sure.
Bob says:

January 15, 2008 at 11:45 pm

dunno, anyone can use your name just like anyone can use mine. Unless you can compare ip addresses, it doesn’t make sense to be so sure.
dunno says:

January 16, 2008 at 10:00 am

Maybe you’re right Bob. In this age of “trolls” and “sockpuppets” who knows who wrote what? If it wasn’t really you Steve then I apologize. Good luck boys, I’m going to enjoy by own musings for a while.
dunno says:

January 16, 2008 at 2:00 am

Maybe you’re right Bob. In this age of “trolls” and “sockpuppets” who knows who wrote what? If it wasn’t really you Steve then I apologize. Good luck boys, I’m going to enjoy by own musings for a while.
EconE says:

January 16, 2008 at 4:55 pm

Comment removed by Matt.
EconE says:

January 16, 2008 at 8:55 am

Comment removed by Matt.
Chris says:

January 16, 2008 at 5:09 pm

So about the occupancy question…..if the only evidence (or lack thereof) is that only a handful are up for resale or rental, how do we know a whole bunch of owners aren’t sitting on the sidelines waiting for the “big spring selling season”? Is there any better evidence of usage available?
Chris says:

January 16, 2008 at 9:09 am

So about the occupancy question…..if the only evidence (or lack thereof) is that only a handful are up for resale or rental, how do we know a whole bunch of owners aren’t sitting on the sidelines waiting for the “big spring selling season”? Is there any better evidence of usage available?
Steve says:

January 17, 2008 at 1:34 am

Apology accepted, Dunno. I understand the perception of hard selling at a presentation center, but urban buyers are savy and informed. Much of that is because of blogs from Matt, Wendy, and Ben. Hopefully, some education can come from the sales person, too.

My response to the owners perhaps sitting on the sidelines to flip at 5th and Madison. They just are not here in big numbers. Seattle’s real estate investor season was a short couple years. Fall 2003 to Spring 2006, give or take a few months. Cristalla started it…. Cosmo and 2200 Westlake landed right in the most enthusiastic period. By time we came on the market at 5th and Madison in May 2006, a handful of investors joined, but a number dropped back out. (One who came and went was featured recently in the Sunday Times real estate section with his 2200 Westlake investment. He entered a contract…but this experienced condo buyer anticipated moderate growth the next couple of years, not the kind of spike that will make one good money.)

I will say a small wild card on flips anywhere would be 2nd home buyers who dropped a lot money on a place, if the market picks up, they could free up an asset. (I have a 2nd home seller at Cristalla if someone is interested in that property.)

Steve Paoli
Williams Marketing
Steve says:

January 16, 2008 at 5:34 pm

Apology accepted, Dunno. I understand the perception of hard selling at a presentation center, but urban buyers are savy and informed. Much of that is because of blogs from Matt, Wendy, and Ben. Hopefully, some education can come from the sales person, too.

My response to the owners perhaps sitting on the sidelines to flip at 5th and Madison. They just are not here in big numbers. Seattle’s real estate investor season was a short couple years. Fall 2003 to Spring 2006, give or take a few months. Cristalla started it…. Cosmo and 2200 Westlake landed right in the most enthusiastic period. By time we came on the market at 5th and Madison in May 2006, a handful of investors joined, but a number dropped back out. (One who came and went was featured recently in the Sunday Times real estate section with his 2200 Westlake investment. He entered a contract…but this experienced condo buyer anticipated moderate growth the next couple of years, not the kind of spike that will make one good money.)

I will say a small wild card on flips anywhere would be 2nd home buyers who dropped a lot money on a place, if the market picks up, they could free up an asset. (I have a 2nd home seller at Cristalla if someone is interested in that property.)

Steve Paoli
Williams Marketing
Leann says:

January 29, 2008 at 9:26 pm

Steve,
I know I am late in posting this, but I wanted to make a note here. I have taken multiple buyers through your sales center at 5th and Mad and have been extremely impressed by your professionalism, knowledge, and sales tactic. What I appreciate most is the lack of “hard selling” that I have seen from you. It allows me to do my job as their agent. I have had many Buyers comment that it was one of the better sales experiences they have had. Props to you and your sales style.
Leann says:

January 30, 2008 at 5:26 am

Steve,
I know I am late in posting this, but I wanted to make a note here. I have taken multiple buyers through your sales center at 5th and Mad and have been extremely impressed by your professionalism, knowledge, and sales tactic. What I appreciate most is the lack of “hard selling” that I have seen from you. It allows me to do my job as their agent. I have had many Buyers comment that it was one of the better sales experiences they have had. Props to you and your sales style.

Trace North now three months delayed

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